Integration is really a class/education thing?

Over the weekend, I had a lengthy discussion on immigration and integration with a friend. Friend believes that immigrants who are more likely to retain old country values (ranging from total arranged marriages (i.e. not “this is A, this is B. You guys go out on supervised ‘dates’ and then decide whether you like each other or not” type arrangements) to marrying young to not moving out until marriage, etc) are those who are not as educated. Educated people, my friend believes, are more open to their children adopting mainstream, Anglo-Saxon (or Francophone if you’re in Quebec) values because they’re more exposed. In fact, they probably have picked up some of the values themselves (even if it’s more old fashioned - my mother, for example, gave me an etiquette book when I was 12. This etiquette book is likely a traditional gift to a 10-12 year old who attends junior cotillions and will be a debutante in her late teens. I was not a debutante. They aren’t all that common in Toronto, unless you’re Filipina). Friend cited the European immigrants who came in the 1900s or even after WWII. Many of these immigrants only had two or three years of formal education compared to Anglo Canadians had at the time (probably Grade 8-ish). They worked unskilled jobs and their social lives revolved around their place of worship which spoke the language from the motherland and observed traditions of the country.

I think my friend is only partially right in this case. There are plenty of immigrants who are really well-educated, yet their credentials from abroad do not make them qualified for the jobs they did in the old country. Immigrants who are the most integrated, those who have picked up Anglo-Saxon values are those who were educated here. Why? Because they came young. When you’re 18 years old and away from home, the first thing you want to do is something that is considered taboo to your parents. This isn’t only something that foreign students do, but basically anyone who is going to school out of town! For some people, the new values stick, especially if you intend to stay in the new country. There aren’t parents to tell you that what you’re doing is not proper.  In addition, parents who are willing to send their kids abroad, especially girls, are probably already open-minded anyway.  It’s also the exposure that they may have career-wise.  I have noticed that many immigrants who are in, say, finance or law (especially of their senior management), are more culturally Anglo than even equally educated (or perhaps more so) and equally financially well-off doctors whose patients are primarily from the immigrant communities.  The doctor, in turn, is probably “more exposed”/culturally Anglo than someone who owns a small business.

Readers, do you think this is true? Is education the key to being more open-minded and perhaps even integrating? Or is it a combination of being educated in the new country and education itself?  Is it a class thing?

Passing on Traditions and Keeping in Touch with One’s Roots

Matthew Egan has a post in Racialicious today about his Jewish identity. At the end of the post, mentions a conversation his fiancée had with another woman, who grew up in Chinatown about understanding one’s roots. But what does that mean in the twenty-first century? Culture changes so rapidly that many traditions become obsolete. Other traditions were invented or adapted by immigrants when they arrive in their new homeland.

I often read stories about ABCs or CBCs (American Born Chinese or Canadian Born Chinese) who are conflicted between tradition and their Americanized/Canadianized identity they picked up at school. Reading these stories, I’ve always wondered WTF they’re talking about. I went to school with lots of kids who were either born in Canada or came as young children, and never have I met a parent who wasn’t accommodating to their kids’ westernized lifestyle, save for dating non-Chinese. In fact, most parents are westernized themselves. Most people I know don’t know what it means to have “traditional Chinese parents.” Perhaps it’s a generational thing. Most American/Canadian authors of Chinese descent are from an older generation, typically Baby Boomers (e.g. Amy Tan) or born during the Depression/WWII (e.g. Wayson Choy). They typically grew up in Chinatown or a small town, with parents who worked in small businesses rather than suburban-raised kids with middle-management/professional parents.

I share the same issues as Matthew when it comes to understanding my roots. Because my upbringing was “typically suburban,” and the guy I’ll likely marry isn’t of Chinese descent, I worry that I’d be criticized that I’m not able to pass on Chinese culture beyond language (speaking only), food, holidays like the Lunar New Year and Mid-Autumn Festival and perhaps one or two milestone traditions, such as a baby’s coming out/presentation at 30 days or wedding traditions (many aren’t “real traditions” as they probably only date back to the 1910s or 1920s at the earliest when people started to have love marriages rather than arranged ones).  Or would people care?  Is that really enough to pass on?  In Toronto, one can be exposed to these traditions without doing much.  All you need to do is open a newspaper.  The Lunar New Year and Mid-Autumn Festival get lots of press in a city like Toronto or Vancouver, even with non-Asian media.  Is passing on these traditions really keeping in touch with one’s roots, or is it just part of being a cultured Torontonian?

Another “OMG SATC is sooooooo racist post” at Racialicious

See here. And I am not the only person who is completely sick of all this complaining. Can’t people just allow others to enjoy the movie without all that complaining? It’s always the following:

Jennifer Hudson’s character Louise being a modern version of the Mammy character: Well, Louise is a 20something. As I said in an earlier SATC-related post, most girls Louise’s age DO work as assistants. Unless you’re starting your own business or maybe working in a family business, there’s no way you’re going to be a CEO at that age. You have to work from the bottom up. You do crap work for crap pay.

Lily Goldenblatt not having too many lines/seen as a prop: Well she’s (they? Lily was played by twins) a kid. What do you expect? Brady doesn’t have many lines either. Or is it different because Brady is a boy (and none of the men, with the exception of Big) had lots of lines.

Asian guy interviewing for Carrie’s job: Some posters see this guy as sissy. I saw him as gay. And over-qualified. Dude worked as an assistant at Goldman (or was it Merrill?)…Carrie’s job probably pays less than $14-$16/h…and that’s if Carrie’s generous. It might even be $12-$13/h. Gay Asian Guy was probably paid closer to $20-something/h on Wall Street.

Charlotte worried about food poisoning: Lots of SATC sites and message boards looked at it as this: Charlotte either knew that she was pregnant or suspected that she was. That’s why she wasn’t drinking either.

Miranda ’s “follow the white guy with a baby line”: This is the only one, IMHO that really should be seen as being “off” when it comes to race. But you can also see it as Miranda not wanting to live in a slummy neighbourhood. Manhattan’s Chinatown (at least the last time I visited) is in worse condition than Toronto’s!

I also don’t really understand the “I can’t relate to the SATC girls because I’m not white” line. I am a total Charlotte (with a little bit of Miranda). And I am Chinese. In fact, when it comes to the Charlotte part, I might be even more Charlotte than Charlotte! I mean, I would never, ever, ever, ever go for a name like Shayla!  EWW!

US Version of Little Mosque on the Prairie to air 2009ish

According to the Globe and Mail, an American version of the show is set to debut some time next year.  Anyone worried that it’ll be screwed up?  I am WILLING TO BET that Fox will make the Muslim characters lower-income.  And no way would the Baber character be a funny bigot.

Canada’s GG and Minorities and an Ivy Education

Another interesting post from Racialicious.

First Comment (originally from Womanist Musings):

Canada’s current Governor-General, Michaëlle Jean is black.  A well-known Quebecois writer, Victor-Lévy Beaulieu, recent called her La Reine-Nègre (The Negro Queen), which sparked controversy.  He claims that he didn’t mean anything racist, just her attitude.
What’s interesting is that the last Governor-General, Adrienne Clarkson, is of Chinese descent.  She was also criticized about the way she did things, but I don’t recall anyone calling her the Empress Dowager. People DID say something about her being female, and that no one would have said anything about the spending if she had been a guy.

Second Comment (Originally from Blackline):

“If you are a minority, chances are you will run into a teacher who seems to like you a lot, and at this point they will make it their life mission to save you (kind of like Dangerous Minds). These teachers are extremely condescending and take it personally when you disagree with them in any way (you’re seen as fighting them, preventing them from helping you).  In their minds, you grew up in a single parent shack, your mother works three jobs, and you have 10 brothers and sisters, rather than being a son of a physician and a lawyer. It’s one thing to be admired by your teacher, it’s another being their charity, because in the end all your other classmates will win the awards, and you will get a pat on the back.”

I’d say that CERTAIN minority groups are thought of as living in a shack, with a single mom who works several jobs.  In my case, I’m more likely to be thought of as a foreigner than some poor kid from the wrong side of town.

Hong Kong Mallrat voice vs. “White” Valley Girl/Uptalk

The HK Mallrat voice is that “young” or “baby” voice that many Chinese (or perhaps more accurately, Cantonese) girls/women speak with. I don’t really know the origins of HK Mallrat, but I think it came around the same time as the Valley Girl…some time in the 1980s. I’ve seen old HK movies (pre mid-1980s) and none of the women spoke that way, not even teens, so you can’t say that Cantonese speaking women “naturally” have younger-sounding voices. This is usually paired with what some people I know call “puppy dog eyes.” Usually, these women are middle class or wealthy.

Most of us know what White Valley Girl/Uptalk is. For those of you who don’t, it’s when, like, a girl, talks kinda like this?? And she’s, like, not exactly too confident in herself?? Total exaggeration, but whatevs. The pattern/dialect/whatever you want to call it has been made fun of in movies like Clueless and the TV show, The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air (Hilary is totallllly an Uptalker!). So yes, demographically (from a socio-economic POV), the Uptalker and HK Mallrat are the same.

The sad part is that both styles are common in women over university age. And some girls just don’t know how or when to turn it off. I think it’s kind of okay if you talk like that with friends, but at work? I don’t think so. Sure, most Uptalkers turn off their “likes” but the Uptalk continues. Don’t these women worry that they sound like they’re in their early 20s or even younger? Especially if they look young? How on earth can they be taken seriously? Many people already assume that a young looking person is the intern, not the full time, fully paid employee. I thought most young looking people in their twenties and thirties didn’t want to be treated like a kid?

I honestly don’t know which one is more annoying. A 30 year old (or older) talking like she’s a child is just as dumb as a 30 year old saying “like” and “whatever.” In both cases, she can attract the wrong type of partner.  In both cases, it’s difficult for her to move up, career-wise.

No babysitters, please, we’re not from here!

An acquaintance of mine once said that he and his wife do not use sitters because where they’re from, it’s always family members who take care of the children if the parents have to be away. They said that no one in the old country used sitters. I wanted to disagree with him, but didn’t want to come out sounding politically incorrect. Sure, it may be true for general, every day people, but I really doubt wealthy people from the old country would agree. I can’t think of any country where the wealthy have historically lived just like the “masses.” Wealthy people always had servants of some sort, and this includes nannies/nurses. It’s just that now, “regular people” also use outside help. His little speech made it sound like people who had the money to afford servants weren’t really “part” of the country culture. HUH? I’m pretty sure historically speaking, these were the people who shaped it. They’re the ones whose names are in the records and history books. Unless, of course, he’s only talking about “regular” people.

What gets really odd is that this guy isn’t FROM the old country.  In fact, he was born in the UK and raised in Canada.  He’s probably been to the “old country” less than ten times in his life, yet it seems that he feels connected to the “old country” much more than any other 1.5 or second generation Canadian I know.   Even his wife is from the “old country,” an arranged marriage.  I know other people who have had arranged marriages, but they all married people who were either born or raised here. Did his parents brainwash him?  If so, it’s seriously a WHAT NOT TO DO situation.  It’s parents like his that slow down the acceptance process.

*NOTE: I was mostly raised by my grandmother, but my family still hired a “sitter” to stay with me between 4 and 5:30 while my grandmother cooked dinner.*

Class and the Hong Kong Canuck - Affected by British Colonialism?

Many Hong Kong Canadians don’t really think about race unless something happens within their own communities, like the SARS issue in 2003. Perhaps it has to do with their comfy, middle class lifestyle. So today’s Racialicious post on Class and Race had me wondering. Would Chinese Canadians from Hong Kong feel the same had the British never arrived? Would they be as successful? So in other words, are they living off the “benefits” of colonialsim? Without the Opium Wars in the 1840s and eventual takeover of Hong Kong proper, Kowloon and the “new territories”, would Hong Kong just be another hick town (as it was back in the day)? I mean, one of the reasons why Hong Kong eventually became so successful was because of communism in China. It was the port between China and the west. In order to get to China, you had to go through Hong Kong. Until recently, if you wanted to get things done cheaply, you had it made in Hong Kong. Had Hong Kong not been a British colony, it would have been absorbed in by the communist government. This means that there’d be no middle man. Hong Kong also received lots of refugees from Shanghai after WWII and many of them were businesspeople. In addition, people in Hong Kong would probably not be all that educated as the educated would likely be from Beijing and Shanghai.

Then there’s immigration. Without the British, Hong Kongers (in general, anyway) who come to Canada, if they can afford to at all, would not be moving into a cushy suburban house so soon after landing. Markham, Ontario and Richmond, British Columbia would probably be very white. This means no Pacific Mall. No yummy Chinese food. Double :-(. Upper middle class Hong Kong Canadians sending their kids to old line prep schools like Upper Canada College or Havergal? Highly unlikely that many would. They wouldn’t be able to afford it, and these schools’ traditions, which are linked to the great old schools of Britain would be completely foreign to them. Most minorities at these schools, at least when I went, were from colonies or former colonies. This is probably why most Hong Kong Canadians are perfectly open to joining and/or participating in organizations and events that would have excluded them years ago. Hong Kong Canadians are, for some reason, more likely to forgive and forget (which is why I’ve had some issues with my boyfriend, who is Jewish).  Hong Kong Canadians also seem to prefer “higher class” things that are seen as “white” by other non-white communities, such as western classical music.  Most Hong Kongers and Hong Kong Canadians take piano and/or violin.  And tennis (so they can play at that country club).  Even guys.  Doing this doesn’t make you white-washed.  Playing electric guitar in a garage band and playing hockey, however, does.  To many HK Canadians, in order to be successful, one must be “accomplished” in that Jane Austeneque (albiet slightly updated) kind of way.

Of course, hindsight is 20/20, and you never know. What’s done is done, and who knows what could have happened without the Opium Wars? Maybe China would be like Japan rather than a communist country and Hong Kong would still be successful as a “snowbird” destination for seniors in Beijing and Shanghai…flying there to escape the colder winters.

Momma McGuinty, Conservative Jewish Leader think Dalton McGuinty is crazy

His angry mom, a conservative Jew and even e-mails from thousands of Ontarians (so many, in fact, that it’s crashed their system) isn’t stopping Ontario Premier, Dalton McGuinty, from having second thoughts about the Ontario government’s proposal to get rid of the Lord’s Prayer. Should Mr. McGuinty and his people be listnening to the people of Ontario and focus on more serious issues like poverty, healthcare and the economy rather than changing tradition? Just because it isn’t your country or culture’s tradition, doesn’t mean that it’s someone else’s tradition. The politically correct, which is, unfortunately A LOT of people (politicians or non) today (at least the public person), seems to want to get rid of old English Canadian traditions, yet include old traditions of other cultures, which can be just as “exclusive” to a culture or cultures. I don’t understand why a non-Christian can complain about something like the Lord’s Prayer, yet if I complained about another religion’s prayer, then I’m anti-something or other. It’s not fair.

Toronto Star article

Formerly Restricted Clubs - OK or Not OK?

I had a bit of a debate with my boyfriend yesterday. He’s Jewish, I’m Chinese (and Catholic). At one time, neither of us would have been given membership at many (if not all) golf & country clubs (and many other membership organizations, including some women’s associations) in Canada and in many other parts of the world. In some cases, we wouldn’t even have been allowed in as guests. In the past twenty or so years, many have loosened up their membership rules and have begun accepting non-WASP members. To many Chinese Canadians (at least Hong Kong Canadians), including myself, what’s in the past is in the past, and if they’re welcome now, why not. This doesn’t seem to ring true with a lot of Jewish people. My boyfriend even said that some of his family members would be downright uncomfortable if they find out that they’re guests at a formerly restricted club. Probably even more uncomfortable if they find out that a Jewish family member is seeking membership (perhaps even thinking that they’re selling out? Who knows!).

Does this have to do with colonialism in Hong Kong? Members of reciprocal clubs from Hong Kong or Singapore who immigrate to Canada seeking membership? The lack of wealthier Chinese Canadians in the past (pre-70s), meaning fewer predominantly Chinese organizations? From the Jewish perspective, is it because most Jews in North America are white, and because their race is invisible, then it makes it more uncomfortable (and if that’s the case, can’t you say the same about being Catholic? I’ve heard stories about Rose Kennedy being blackballed from the Junior League of Boston because she was Catholic (and Irish?). I’m pretty sure that today, the Junior League of Boston has lots and lots of Catholic members.)

What do you think, readers?